The Limits of Demon Deals

[itsnotmymind]

What are the limits of crossroads demons in SPN?

Prior to AHBL2, I do not think we saw any demon bring back the dead. Dean was dying. Julie (Evan's wife) in Crossroad Blues was dying.

But Sam was dead.

Yet there must be limits on demon deals. No one’s sold their soul for world peace, have they? I feel like once we were told that sometimes demons can only do certain things if someone makes a deal. Like Anya? Like vengeance demons? I’m not sure.

In The Wish, we see Anya completely alter reality, but I don't think we ever see anything like that from a vengeance demon again. The implication are never address. Can crossroads demons alter realty?

Comments

[supernutjapan.livejournal.com]

I don't think there is much difference to wishing to be famous and wishing for world peace in terms of changing reality - so yeah, technically you can probably wish for world peace. But, it's likely the demon will twist that into something that is good for them. Remember the guy in crossroads blues who wished to be a great painter, thinking he'd be famous and rich and ended up just.... being a great painter who was penniless and unrecognized? World peace is too big a wish to make specific. The methods would be left open, which is not a good thing when dealing with demons. I also think that demons would refuse any wish that would not be profitable for them, just like they refused Sam's wish to bring his brother back.

[itsnotmymind.livejournal.com]

Demons probably could do a lot of twisting, if they chose. We don't really see much of that, though, do we? George in Crossroad Blues may have been unsuccessful because the demons made it so, but maybe it was just chance. Do we ever see a demon specifically and deliberately twist a deal?

I also think that demons would refuse any wish that would not be profitable for them, just like they refused Sam's wish to bring his brother back.

Good point.

[supernutjapan.livejournal.com]

Well, what I meant by twisting was that they would take the wish literally, and not the way the person meant it, left something deliberately out of the contract or added something for their own profit. And they I'm sure took pleasure in the fact that the person ended up unhappy. Another occasion is Crowley's deal with Bobby, and very probably his deal with the Leviathan. I'm sure he left a crack in that contract that Dick did not see. I guess not telling the people that hell hounds were going to take them to hell in 10 years could be counted as well.

Who's to say how long the world has to be at peace aye? And how?

[itsnotmymind.livejournal.com]

I agree that the demons take delight in luring people to misery, but it always seemed like the epic tragedy of these deals was how obviously stupid they are. Dean once compared it to choosing to go over Nigara in a barrel. These people knew the risks, and did it anyway. Of course, there's a difference between knowing and knowing - I bet they all regretted it big time in Hell, if not sooner. But it's classic SPN, in that people jump into these things with full knowledge of what they are doing. And do it anyway.

Although I suppose S4 changes this slightly: Dean didn't know, the demons didn't tell him, that selling himself for Sam would kick off the apocalypse.

[supernutjapan.livejournal.com]

Dean didn't know, the demons didn't tell him, that selling himself for Sam would kick off the apocalypse.
There it is again LOL Demons will never offer information, although they might tell you a version of the truth if you ask for it. I don't think the people are dumb, just desperate, and desperate people don't consider the consequences (or do, but think it's worth it). They are also not adept at dealing with demons. Maybe they don't even know they are dealing with a demon. Very risky business in any case, aye?

[itsnotmymind.livejournal.com]

Yeah, imagine what the world would be like if you could get anything you want by selling your soul. A consequence years and year in the future - look how people deal with global warming. I can understand the temptation.

[lokifan]

I know little of Supernatural but I did want to comment because it's rarely talked about, but really striking to me, that Anya's magic, the magic of vengeance demons, seems to be the most powerful in the series. As you said, she remakes reality on a grand scale.

[itsnotmymind.livejournal.com]

I'm surprised characters don't try to use that to their advantage, more often. In Entropy, Anya tries to use other people's wishes to get what she wants, but I wonder if they could have found a way to use her magic to stop Willow.